Office wear

[wellinghall]

I know we've touched on this before, but what would you wear to work if the dress code was "smart casual" or "business casual"? Or possibly more to the point (especially if you're a woman!), what do you think I should wear?

Comments

[rosathome.livejournal.com]

Not jeans; possibly cords, probably smart chinos or similar. Proper shirt, possibly a blazer or other non-suit jacket, maybe with jumper underneath if weather-appropriate. Probably a tie.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, girlyswot; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[eldritchhobbit.livejournal.com]

Hmmm... for men, I'd say something along the lines of pressed khakis, a nice dress shirt, and a blazer, with no tie.

[eldritchhobbit.livejournal.com]

...or, depending on the weather, a tie but no blazer.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you for all your comments, eldritchhobbit; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[malaheed.livejournal.com]

I'd recommend dressing up at first then scaling down after a week when you get a better understanding of what other people are wearing

[nineveh-uk.livejournal.com]

I'd second this. Suit and tie seems the straightforward way to go, and then you can assess how the general rule intersects with your own style. And it is much easier to laugh off being too smart than it is too scruffy.

[eldritchhobbit.livejournal.com]

Good point!

[didiusjulianus.livejournal.com]

Good advice. But I'll add that in my experience no version of wellinghall's attire is ever remotely scruffy (and he tends to the more formal of each style of dress, iyswim) so I think he has nothing to worry about.

[gramarye1971]

Thirding this. For that matter, you can always take off the tie or jacket during the day, or keep a spare tie in the office just in case you need to smarten up for a lunch meeting or the like. A friend's father always did that -- he kept three ties neatly tucked away in a drawer in his office, in case he spilled something on one of them or (he or someone else) suddenly needed a tie for whatever reason.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, gramarye1971; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail. (I used to keep my company tie in my drawer at work, for just such an eventuality).

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, nineveh_uk; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, malaheed; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

Oh, whatever you wear to Glorious Goodwood.

[wemyss.livejournal.com]

Hard to go very wrong with tweed, or a blazer later in the year.

Re: Oh, whatever you wear to Glorious Goodwood.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, wemyss; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[king-pellinor.livejournal.com]

The general trend back when I was in such an office was dark trousers and a pale blue shirt in a chequered or striped pattern.

I generally work chinos and a polo shirt, though if I could be bothered with the extra ironing I'd have worn a proper (but short-sleeved) shirt.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, king_pellinor; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[didiusjulianus.livejournal.com]

I think the former (and most of the other suggestions) comes into the bracket of business casual whereas the chinos and polo shirt is more smartish casual in a non-work sense, for most employers, and hence a bit too dressed down except maybe for "dress down Fridays" in a business casual environment. (Unless you are in IT or creative industries which seem different).

When I went into Deloitte their version of 'business casual' seemed usually a tie but not always, then a shirt, trousers, not often a jacket or full suit, unless meeting high-up clients or bosses occasionally. I think that with the tie/no tie thing is, that you can get away with a very smart shirt/trousers with no tie, or a slightly more casual look of shirt/trousers with a tie, but not both at the same time. (Which is one reason why bek wears a tie to work).

Collarless or 'designed with an open neck' shirts that can't take a tie are another option.

[king-pellinor.livejournal.com]

We were generally supposed to wear a suit for meeting clients, and so there was normally quite a large proportion of suits around on any given day (usually temporarily sans jacket/tie though). Exaggerated, of course, by the sort of person who wants to look as if they have a lot of meetings coming up, or might at any moment be called on to attend one :-)

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thanks for this, and for your other comments, didiusjulianus. I will do another post about this shortly.

[philmophlegm.livejournal.com]

Ah - I feel qualified to write on this as a) a man and b) someone who works for a firm with a "business casual" dress code.

Firstly, I would definitely echo malaheed's advice about dressing towards the smarter end at first, and then going more casual rather than the other way around. In a "business casual" environment, on any given day some people will probably be dressed in just "business smart" (usually this means suit, shirt and tie) because of seeing clients.

So what to wear?

At the smarter end of "business casual" - pin-striped, single-breasted suit*, smart shirt, no tie, smart black shoes (or if you value fashion over style, brown shoes, but personally I can't stand the mix of brown shows and navy suit).

At the most casual end - polo shirt, chinos, slightly more casual shoes (but not trainers or even trainer-like shoes).

In between - suit with t-shirt can look smart and stylish (v-necked t-shirts are smarter than round-necke, although bear in mind that once you take off your suit jacket, you're left with just a t-shirt and trousers). Instead of a suit, a blazer or what used to be referred to as a 'sports jacket' with non-matching trousers is not as smart as a suit, but still looks "smart casual". You should be careful to avoid looking like you've just walked off the golf course though. I would avoid blazers with brass buttons, because they just look silly.

Quick sample of what the blokes in my office are wearing today:
I'm in grey cashmere v-neck jumper over a black t-shirt, with smart trousers and smart black shoes.

One manager is in polo-shirt and chinos.

Most common outfit would seem to be smart trousers and open-necked shirt, but I don't know if this is a suit with the jacket taken off, or just shirt and trousers.

Don't forget the all-important Dilbert rule when it comes to summer clothing - only wear a short-sleeved shirt if you aren't going to wear a tie. A combination of short-sleeved shirt and tie means that people will assume you're there to fix the photocopier, not produce an actuarial valuation of a £20billion defined benefit scheme.



Country versus city is an important distinction because it determines how much brown and check you can get away with. Bristol is a little bit like Plymouth, but not quite as much, in that it is a city with noddings towards rural style. This means that you can get away with things like check shirts, brown trousers, tweed jackets etc that you probably wouldn't wear if you worked at Canary Wharf. I notice this a lot when I visit our offices in London (especially Canary Wharf) and compare them to the likes of Plymouth.


* Double-breasted suit without a tie just looks odd I think.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you very much for all your comments, philmophlegm; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[philmophlegm.livejournal.com]

Just to properly check for you - I asked two colleagues from our Bristol office who deal with your new employers and they said that their dress seemed very similar to JOLF's.

[segh.livejournal.com]

"Hey, which of all these is the correct thing to wear?
Hey, whichever I select."

"Smart casual" is the devil of a rubric because nobody knows what it means. I used to think it was invented by managers to upset staff. After some years I realised that it was a clever trick on the part of the management to discover who's disaffected - if they turn up in a suit it means they're going to interviews.

[garamondbophin.livejournal.com]

Oh, dear - I don't want them to think I'm disaffected, it's just that I can either do suits or pyjamas and very little in between...

(On "Jeans Days" I pay the money, but remind them that I am not going to buy a pair of jeans for the first time in 20 years just to show that I support worthy causes!)

[segh.livejournal.com]

If you always wear a suit they can't tell!

[didiusjulianus.livejournal.com]

Yeah there is one guy who wears a suit everyday in bek's office. He doesn't have to, but chooses to because that is what he likes. bek. hasn't worn his suit for so long he's grown out of it AND lost half of it. But he doesn't work in the same environment that wellinghall is going into.

In SOME offices it can be frowned upon for non-top-bosses to wear suits because that is the uniform of the top boss(es), which is one reason I think a jacket, trousers and tie (to take off or put on, whatever) might be better than a suit on the first day. So wellinghall needs to steer clear of that faux pas as well as the not-being-smart-enough one.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, garamondbophin; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Ah yes, the monks of cool ...

Anyway, thank you, segh; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[wellinghall.livejournal.com]

Thank you, nienna_nineve; I'll do another post shortly, setting out my position in more detail.

[philmophlegm.livejournal.com]

It's possibly worth adding that the phrase can mean something slightly different in the US than it does here. American business casual seems to be casual but without jeans and trainers whereas British business casual often means suit but no tie.